1. 802.24 Vertical Applications TAG
May 2019
Atlanta, GA, USA
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

2. doc.: IEEE 802.15-<doc#>
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doc.: IEEE <doc#>
Overview
Officers
TAG Chair: Tim Godfrey
Secretary & TAG Vice Chair: Ben Rolfe
Task Groups
Smart Grid TG Tim Godfrey
IoT TG Chris DiMinico
26 Voting Members
Agenda:
Meetings for the Week
Tuesday PM2 24
Wednesday PM
Manual attendance tracking for & members
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3. Agenda – 802.24-19-0011r2 Tim Godfrey, EPRI
Agenda - May 2019, Atlanta, Georgia, USA 1
Tuesday PM2 session
1.1
Call session to order, present “Guidelines for IEEE SA meetings”, Quorum
Godfrey 5
4:00 PM
1.2
Review of Agenda / Approval of Agenda
4:05 PM
1.3
Approve minutes from prior TAG meeting
4:10 PM
1.4
Introduction/meeting objectives / Review action items from previous meeting
4:15 PM
1.5
Liaison Review 10
4:20 PM
1.6
Smart Grid Task Group
4:30 PM
1.7
ITU and regulatory items
Godfrey/Holcomb 15
1.8
Collaboration with : 'Network Enablers for Seamless HMD-based VR (Virtual Reality)’
Godfrey / Das 30
4:45 PM
1.9
Progressing "Network Integration" concept into a project
5:15 PM 2
Recess
5:45 PM
Wednesday PM2 session
2.1
Call to Order TAG
2.2
Liasion Discussion of IEC SEG8 report "Deliverable 3_Market Trend_Meeting_Review"
2.3
Update on P2413 Liaison
Winkel?
2.4
Update on ATIS TOPS Liaison on IoT
Godfrey/Khatibi
Low Latency White Paper
Holland 40
5:25 PM
2.5
Whitepaper/document for application-specific use cases of Sub 1GHz standards g and ah
Godfrey/Rolfe
5:40 PM
2.6
New Action Items, New Activities, AOB
5:50 PM
2.7
Adjourn
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

4. Guidelines for IEEE-SA Meetings
All IEEE-SA standards meetings shall be conducted in compliance with all applicable laws, including antitrust and competition laws.
Don’t discuss the interpretation, validity, or essentiality of patents/patent claims.
Don’t discuss specific license rates, terms, or conditions.
Relative costs, including licensing costs of essential patent claims, of different technical approaches may be discussed in standards development meetings.
Technical considerations remain primary focus
Don’t discuss or engage in the fixing of product prices, allocation of customers, or division of sales markets.
Don’t discuss the status or substance of ongoing or threatened litigation.
Don’t be silent if inappropriate topics are discussed… do formally object.
If you have questions, contact the IEEE-SA Standards Board Patent Committee Administrator at or visit
See IEEE-SA Standards Board Operations Manual, clause and “Promoting Competition and Innovation: What You Need to Know about the IEEE Standards Association's Antitrust and Competition Policy” for more details.
This slide set is available at
IEEE 802 Executive Committee

5. Participation in IEEE 802 Meetings
November 2016
doc.: ec EC
Participation in IEEE 802 Meetings
Participation in any IEEE 802 meeting (Sponsor, Sponsor subgroup, Working Group, Working Group subgroup, etc.) is on an individual basis
• Participants in the IEEE standards development individual process shall act based on their qualifications and experience. ( section 5.2.1)
• IEEE 802 Working Group membership is by individual; “Working Group members shall participate in the consensus process in a manner consistent with their professional expert opinion as individuals, and not as organizational representatives”. (subclause “Establishment”, of the IEEE 802 LMSC Working Group Policies and Procedures)
• Participants have an obligation to act and vote as an individual and not under the direction of any other individual or group. A Participant’s obligation to act and vote as an individual applies in all cases, regardless of any external commitments, agreements, contracts, or orders.
• Participants shall not direct the actions or votes of any other member of an IEEE 802 Working Group or retaliate against any other member for their actions or votes within IEEE 802 Working Group meetings, see section and the IEEE 802 LMSC Working Group Policies and Procedures, subclause “Chair”, list item x.
By participating in IEEE 802 meetings, you accept these requirements. If you do not agree to these policies then you shall not participate.
(Latest revision of IEEE 802 LMSC Working Group Policies and Procedures: )
Slide 5
IEEE 802 Executive Committee
Page 5
Dorothy Stanley, HP Enterprise

6. Administration Attendance take on IMAT Web page Mailing list
Reciprocal rights for most WGs
Web page
Mailing list
(voters list)
Document archive
IEEE 802 announcement reflector,
Send to with no subject and with the
following 2 lines appearing first in the body of the message
Subscribe stds-802-all
end
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

7. 802.24 TAG Approve March minutes TAG Action Items from March:
Get latest P2413 draft for private area
Subir Das to provide VR text for TSN White Paper
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

8. Liaison Review P2413 Ludwig Winkel ATIS TOPS Farrokh Khatibi
Wi-Fi Alliance (Informal) Alan Berkema
IEC SEG8 Patrick Wetterwald (concluding)
IEEE PSCC TF S6 Marc Lacroix
IEEE P Bob Heile
Industrial Internet Consortium Wael Diab (status?)
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

9. ITU and Radio Regulatory Items
Update from – Jay Holcomb
900 MHz licensed spectrum NPRM (Broadband)
Will be discussed at Open Meeting of FCC
Interference with ISM?
OFCOM – MHz consultation
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

10. Collaboration with 802.21 AR/VR Vertical Applications
'Network Enablers for Seamless HMD-based VR (Virtual Reality)’
Subir Das
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

11. Goals for AR/VR collaboration in 802.24
IEEE 802 can create a community for developing a suite of capabilities suited for this class of applications
Moving the focus from maximizing throughput only to also consider quality of experience and reliability.
Build on Low Latency White Paper
Broadly define the set of applications (vertical and otherwise) around bounded / low latency
Look at the VR architecture diagram and consider the appropriate standard for each link. They will be a mix of wireless and wired.
In current white paper, latency limit is 5mS. Combination of wired/wireless.
Some use case may incorporate a WAN.
Existing testing shows challenges exceeding two hops (switches) in a network
IEEE 802 could provide comparable services to what is promised by 5G.
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

12. Goals for AR/VR collaboration in 802.24
plans to provide the services layer above the MAC/PHY
AR/VR is an identified vertical application for Smart Grid (electric utilities) for field force, safety, and training
will liaise to other WGs if they develop amendments to their standards to support RTC.
will provide input on requirements to WGs
Vertical Application areas can provide input on specific use cases
Include representatives from related activities in other WG’s
will provide a venue for collaboration (joint meetings) at Plenary
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

13. Next Steps 802.21 to provide text contributions
Goal is to have the real time white paper by 2020?
Bring together various working groups to solve issues for VR and performance.
Application space is driven by ever increasing resolution. Target HDMI 1.2 specification. Resolution and frame rate drive data rate. Can it be compressed?
This can be seen as alternative to 5G approaches, but standards-based and lower cost to use.
Show how Wi-Fi technology can provide an equally good or better result and performance (bandwidth and low jitter and low latency)
Map identified uses cases on to various IEEE 802 standards.
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

14. “Network Integration” action item
Define the value and differentiation of the IEEE 802 architecture in the context of vertical markets
How is IEEE 802 better suited to deployment in the communication infrastructure of private enterprise, industry, and the individual user? 
Compared to network architectures oriented towards service providers
The IEEE 802 architecture enables networks that are like Ethernet: Well understood, mature, predictable. A “cleaner” integration of disparate technologies under the common architecture and addressing.
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

15. Review of 802.1CF in this context
Introductory Presentation
Max Riegel “Thoughts on IEEE 802 network integration with respect to P802.1CF” r0
Discussion
Based on many discussions of the place of in 5G.
5G SC
Conclusions – AANI integrating into 5G domain. Nothing corresponding in 3GPP
Industry connections – NENDICA
Flexible Factory IoT, Data Center Bridging
What’s missing – a picture of 802 as a peer to 5G
5G promises they will do “everything”
But, they don’t do anything wired
5G requires an extensive PLMN to support it.
It is designed to help the cellular operator grow their market
Verticals might not want an operator in the middle of their network
Value proposition: 802 networks are customer-owned
Example – Santa Clara Emergency services issues
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

16. Points For Whitepaper Outline
IEEE 802 is a transport network
IEEE 802 is Layer 2
3GPP RAN is layer 3 only, Layer 2 is not available
Direct support of IPv4 and IPv6 or pure layer 2 protocols
Trade-off between flexibility (L2) and scalability (L3)
Routing provides path to higher scale
Smaller scale provide more flexibility
Smaller scale provides opportunity for real-time
IEEE 802 can route via L3 when needed. 3GPP cannot offer L2
IEEE 802 can also offer L2 routing when appropriate (e.g )
Not an alternative to L3 routing, but there to address a different problem
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

17. Points For Whitepaper Outline
802 does not provide as many means control a specific end device and it’s traffic on a path.
There are some management facilities in some standards
3GPP networks provide more tools for subscriber management
802 provides local networks that may be (but don’t have to be) connected into an Internet.
Operator networks are focused on services for single devices, while 802 networks support and include multiple devices (networks of networks) – devices can communicate with each other as well as with other networks
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

18. Points For Whitepaper Outline: Re: Non-802 wireless IoT networks
Commercial, proprietary IoT services
They don’t have an ethernet like L2. The system does not have the concept of a LAN. It is terminal to central “gateway” only. Star topology only.
Similar to LTE UE to UE traffic that must route through core. (DTD Proximity services have addressed that to some extent)
5G URLLC, and MMTC.
IEEE 802 has already developed TSN in wired, and now being developed for wireless.
Latency is impossible to guarantee in unlicensed, shared spectrum. However it can be highly optimized by the MAC layer.
IEEE 802 has a history and internal coordination of coexistence between different standards operating in unlicensed spectrum. 3GPP is oriented towards exclusively licensed spectrum, “sharing” is a foreign concept.
3GPP has a common strategy for the three use cases. IEEE 802 has a common architecture, but not a common business strategy.
License exempt can provide higher economic value per MHz of spectrum.
See WFA economic value. Cisco Visual Networking Index. Wi-Fi carries more data than all cellular spectrum
Wi-Fi created the expectation of broadband wireless that led to the development of LTE
What would it look like to combine multiple IEEE 802 standards into a single offering?
Some vendors already do that – integrating 802 technologies into systems.
The “Package” offered by the “5G” ecosystem is clearly articulated.
What is the comparable offering from IEEE 802?
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

19. Points For Whitepaper Outline
IEEE needs to think about how to create that package without a “subscription model”
IEEE 802 is often free
IEEE 802 is deployed in vertical markets, where the network is owned and operated by the user of the services.
Are there other models for IEEE 802 other than subscription that can provide ancillary economic value?
Is management of shared spectrum a candidate?
IEEE 802 and unlicensed spectrum enables faster innovation
Many of the breakthrough innovations were not as planned
The story of why IEEE 802 complements everything else, and everything else (alone) is not sufficient.
IoT is built around many specialized niches. The challenge is meeting the diverse requirements. IEEE 802 provides multiple standards to address multiple IoT applications.
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

20. Next Steps Develop TOC for white paper from these points
Volunteers requested provide text contributions for white paper
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

21. Wednesday TAG
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

22. Liaison with IEC SEG8 Scope of SEG8:
Assess, provide an overview and prioritization of the evolution of technical development and standardization in the field of communication technologies and architectures
The report includes aspects relevant to both Smart Grid and IoT.
New Document shared in Private Area
IEC_SEG8_Deliverable 3_Market Trend_Meeting_Review_010419_v3_clean.pdf
Final Opportunity to review and comment as SEG8 is finishing in next few months
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

23. P2413 Liaison P2413-D0.4.6.pdf currently in Sponsor Ballot
Available in Private Area
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

24. ATIS TOPS Liaison 802.24 provided comments to ATIS in document
r2 (IoT_Characteristics_Matrix.xlsx)
ATIS expressed thanks to the TAG for comments on the IoT Matrix.
There was one follow up question for the TAG:
We did have one question regarding the notes provided for the Smart Transmission grid category. Could you help us understand the comment “this category mixes several applications with differing requirements and characteristics”?
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

25. ATIS TOPS
Discussion and response
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

26. “Low latency” White Paper
Achieving low latency with IEEE 802 standards
Including wired and wireless communications
An alternative (or complement) to 5G URLLC
A set of vertical applications enabled by low latency
The challenges of reliable low latency in unlicensed spectrum.
Adapting TSN’s “FRER” feature
Adapting 802 wireless to licensed spectrum?
Operating over multiple bands or channels?
Special cases for high data rates for immersive video
Oliver Holland to lead white paper development
Current Draft r1
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

27. “Low latency” White Paper
Discussion Notes
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

28. g and ah Coexistence ( )
will develop a whitepaper/document for application-specific use cases. Identifying where each standard is most suitable, and how to make best use of other changes.
Identify use cases where g is not sufficient and both are needed
Could be choices of applications, channel guidelines, duty cycle,
Avoid perception that 802 standards are unable to coexist
Evaluate and describe potential application-level implications of delay/latency increases due to mutual interference
project schedule:
A draft ready by April
WG Ballot Sept 2019
SA Ballot November 2019
Plan to develop a white paper in 2nd half of year. Review status in July
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

29. 2019 TAG Activity Plan “Low latency” White Paper
Include AR/VR activity
Nendica FFIOT might also fit into this
“Network Integration” white paper about unique benefits of IEEE 802 architecture
A whitepaper/document for application-specific use cases of Sub 1GHz standards g and ah. Identifying where each standard is most suitable, and how to make best use of mechanisms proposed in TG.
Can this also include applying s in sub-1GHz spectrum?
2H 2019 for starting
TBD
white paper on IoT and P2413
Update of first Smart Grid white paper to address latest amendments of u, v, w, x, y, Revmd
Tim Godfrey, EPRI

30. 802.24 TAG closing Action Items from this meeting Any New Business?
Tim Godfrey, EPRI